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Showing posts 101 - 120 of 140 |
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Message posted at 10/28/2009, 14:03:41 PM by Shevs |
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Ditto here! Cleaning the database is great and will benefit us all, way to go!
But setting the default to 'donate' is just wrong. You can't give away what's not yours; and some people WILL miss that e-mail for sure. |
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NikonD100 & D700 with various nikon lenses.
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Uploaded files:261 | Total Sales: 1168
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Message posted at 10/28/2009, 14:17:03 PM by Godfer |
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Thankyou, that puts my mind at rest about my images.
| Originally posted by Achilles: |
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Quoted Message: We will set an extra option allowing you to keep all future notifications to default to your preferred action. The first notification will default to free from reasons stated above, but if you want to change it, all future notifications will be sent according to your account's preferences. Basically, you can just ignore the future notifications. Once you checked it the first time, all others will follow the same preferences.
@afagundes: from older to the newer ones. |
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Canon 5D MK II
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Uploaded files:1066 | Total Sales: 22807
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Message posted at 10/28/2009, 22:54:26 PM by Sophieso |
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Just got notice on a file and think it's a really good idea to boot the photo to the free bin.
As usual, plans to tighten up the catalog of photos on this site at it continues to attract some of the best photographers in the world has been handled fairly and with great thought.
Nicely done. |
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Uploaded files:244 | Total Sales: 1052
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Message posted at 10/28/2009, 23:02:47 PM by Bradcalkins |
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Why not just disable them, with no option to re-enable? |
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Canon 7D, various prime and L series lenses
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Uploaded files:2578 | Total Sales: 14614
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Message posted at 10/29/2009, 10:07:44 AM by Sid - member is an admin |
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There's a new option in the selection page where you can set your default to disable instead of donating the image to the free section. Whatever you choose as default will carry on to your future unattended images. |
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550D
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Uploaded files:4 | Total Sales: 474
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Message posted at 10/29/2009, 10:54:54 AM by Wisconsinart |
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| Originally posted by Sid: |
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| Quoted Message: There's a new option in the selection page where you can set your default to disable instead of donating the image to the free section. Whatever you choose as default will carry on to your future unattended images. |
What about the people who have not maintained their account, given up, or just disappeared? You will, in effect, be stealing their images in order to promote DT. I cannot comprehend how that is an acceptable way to do business.
You could have the default set to free GOING FORWARD, but you can't retroactively claim images for your own use when the contractual agreement was to sell images on consignment. |
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Nikon D100
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Uploaded files:840 | Total Sales: 3226
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Message edited at 10/29/2009, 11:39:32 AM by Admin |
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| Originally posted by Wisconsinart: |
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Quoted Message:
What about the people who have not maintained their account, given up, or just disappeared? You will, in effect, be stealing their images in order to promote DT. I cannot comprehend how that is an acceptable way to do business.
You could have the default set to free GOING FORWARD, but you can't retroactively claim images for your own use when the contractual agreement was to sell images on consignment. |
We will address accounts that were not accessed somehow differently. We're trying to think about a good way that would make everyone happy.
In the same time it would be nice if you avoid using words as unethical, stealing etc. This isn't less ethical than it is for a contributor who didn't donate any images but still enjoys sales made by someone motivated to buy by another contributor's donation. Tons of contributors donated images and the traffic they brought eventually got diverted to the commercial database. We spend a lot on the bandwidth this section requires, so please see the full picture before accusing other people. The only benefit the agency has is the increased number of customers. And that is split with the contributors, all of them!
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Nikon D300 / Nikon N80 | Nikon 10.5mm f/2.8G ED AF DX Fishey...
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Uploaded files:2669 | Total Sales: 21465
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Message posted at 10/29/2009, 11:55:11 AM by Cthoman |
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It sounds like a good idea to delete some of the older unsuccessful images. I'm sure we all have a few in our portfolios. While I've heard it is pretty easy to switch the images to delete, I also would prefer the default option was delete rather than free. |
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Uploaded files:3033 | Total Sales: 11457
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Message posted at 10/29/2009, 12:44:20 PM by Wisconsinart |
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| Originally posted by Achilles: |
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Quoted Message: In the same time it would be nice if you avoid using words as unethical, stealing etc. This isn't less ethical than it is for a contributor who didn't donate any images but still enjoys sales made by someone motivated to buy by another contributor's donation. Tons of contributors donated images and the traffic they brought eventually got diverted to the commercial database. We spend a lot on the bandwidth this section requires, so please see the full picture before accusing other people. The only benefit the agency has is the increased number of customers. And that is split with the contributors, all of them!
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I know DT would like to take advantage of those unsold images, they have a monetary value for promotional purposes, but I'm sorry if the language I'm using is appropriate.
The images were submitted with the understanding of certain conditions and DT is now breaking that contract. Would DT take it lightly if contributors signed up to be exclusive and then changed their mind? What's the difference?
It's been common in Eastern Europe to sell pirated copies of software and music, it has been the norm there for a long time, but that is still stealing regardless if it's "just the way things are." I can only assume the same business standards are applying in this case, too, a kind of "look the other way" attitude. That doesn't make it legal.
It seems to be a simple matter; all you have to do is ask for permission. I just do not understand how a business with good intentions will take intellectual property that does not belong to them. In a court of law DT would be liable for paying the contributor for each download if DT did not receive permission to move the image to the free area. This is such a fundamental business concept and it seems to be lost on DT, I think they are being too eager in going forward with this idea.
OK, I won't use the word "stealing." I will say it is very foolish for any business to take "liberties" with copyrighted material. |
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Nikon D100
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Uploaded files:840 | Total Sales: 3226
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Message posted at 10/29/2009, 13:17:02 PM by Bradcalkins |
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| Originally posted by Sid: |
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| Quoted Message: There's a new option in the selection page where you can set your default to disable instead of donating the image to the free section. Whatever you choose as default will carry on to your future unattended images. |
I think contributors would be happy if the default was disable, instead of donate... |
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Canon 7D, various prime and L series lenses
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Uploaded files:2578 | Total Sales: 14614
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Message edited at 10/29/2009, 13:30:59 PM by Nivi |
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Cleaning the database is a great idea, though I find it strange that we going to remove images without reviewers first checking them.
Here is an example, I have 1 photo of a Venetian church in my portfolio, the image maybe nothing spectacular, but it’s a listed touristic landmark, and it is the only photo DT has of this church, even though it never has been downloaded as per date, still one day someone may need it.
I’ll prefer to disable it when the time will come, it doesn’t bother me, but I do wonder how many more unique images or one-of–the–kind can be lost in such automatic clean-up. |
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Uploaded files:446 | Total Sales: 2232
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Message posted at 10/29/2009, 13:26:00 PM by Hipgnosis |
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I just wanted to say that I have no problem to DONATE the images.
I saw here that many contributors are against this, but I'm sure others will perfectly agree.
The main reason I agree with DONATING, first because my pictures were reviewed for free by the DT team, second because I think all the contributors will benefit from that and third because a picture which doesn't have any sales actually worths (almost) nothing.
So those who are commenting about copyright must first have in mind that actually they cannot sell the right because most probably nobody would want to buy it. |
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Sony NEX-5, Nikon D300s, Nikkor 24-120mm f/4G ED VR, Nikon ...
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Uploaded files:428 | Total Sales: 887
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Message edited at 10/29/2009, 13:40:54 PM by Jocky |
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I would like to clean up my portfolio too, but I have some files that do have some (1-3) downloads and therefore I can't offer them as free. On the other way I don't want to disable them. Is there a way I could donate them to the free section?
Thanks
...Totally agree with Hipgnosis |
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My Computer :)
& Canon Rebel T2i, Canon EF 17-40 f4 L...
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Uploaded files:657 | Total Sales: 2400
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Message edited at 10/29/2009, 14:02:12 PM by Wisconsinart |
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| Originally posted by Hipgnosis: |
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Quoted Message: I just wanted to say that I have no problem to DONATE the images.
I saw here that many contributors are against this, but I'm sure others will perfectly agree.
The main reason I agree with DONATING, first because my pictures were reviewed for free by the DT team, second because I think all the contributors will benefit from that and third because a picture which doesn't have any sales actually worths (almost) nothing.
So those who are commenting about copyright must first have in mind that actually they cannot sell the right because most probably nobody would want to buy it. |
Hip, are you just doing this for fun? I've been in the art "world" for 30 years in one form or another and this is a serious matter.
I am investing a lot of time and energy into DT and for them to get into trouble with copyright issues is going to affect all of us and our bottom line.
For example, there is the potential for a number of things to happen, such as a percentage of buyers refusing to purchase from DT for ethical reasons.
It is one of the most fundamental issues in art: You must get permission from the owner FIRST before you use and/or change the terms in the use of a piece. I suppose you causal artists and "dabblers" don't really care, but it's not in our best interest for DT to get mixed up in legal problems. Buyers will run away if DT gets a reputation.
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Nikon D100
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Uploaded files:840 | Total Sales: 3226
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Message posted at 10/29/2009, 14:19:35 PM by Jocky |
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"I suppose you causal artists and "dabblers" don't really care"
It's not nice to talk like this with people you don't really know. |
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My Computer :)
& Canon Rebel T2i, Canon EF 17-40 f4 L...
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Uploaded files:657 | Total Sales: 2400
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Message posted at 10/29/2009, 15:14:01 PM by Hipgnosis |
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| Originally posted by Wisconsinart: |
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Quoted Message:
Hip, are you just doing this for fun? I've been in the art "world" for 30 years in one form or another and this is a serious matter.
I am investing a lot of time and energy into DT and for them to get into trouble with copyright issues is going to affect all of us and our bottom line.
For example, there is the potential for a number of things to happen, such as a percentage of buyers refusing to purchase from DT for ethical reasons.
It is one of the most fundamental issues in art: You must get permission from the owner FIRST before you use and/or change the terms in the use of a piece. I suppose you causal artists and "dabblers" don't really care, but it's not in our best interest for DT to get mixed up in legal problems. Buyers will run away if DT gets a reputation.
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Well, I'm not really a funny guy :)
I'm not a big artist (see my pictures) and it is obvious that I'm not living from DT income. I'm just trying to be logical. Bottom line, DT tries to promote our portfolio for free, using old pictures which didn't make a penny in the last 4 years.
Talking about ethics or reputation, for example, I don't think the people will not buy iPhone because of the Nokia trial.
Thanks Joky for taking my side.
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Sony NEX-5, Nikon D300s, Nikkor 24-120mm f/4G ED VR, Nikon ...
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Uploaded files:428 | Total Sales: 887
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Message edited at 10/29/2009, 15:40:49 PM by Wisconsinart |
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I can ignore the attempt to turn this into a popularity contest.
While the vast majority have gently suggested to DT what the proper ethics here are (I hope DT will take that into consideration), I suppose my experience in such matters has made me more vocal.
Perhaps my only problem is my inability to educate some of the seriousness of this issue.
I've said my piece.
Thanks |
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Nikon D100
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Uploaded files:840 | Total Sales: 3226
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Message posted at 10/29/2009, 15:46:06 PM by Madelaide |
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| Originally posted by Hipgnosis: |
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Quoted Message: I just wanted to say that I have no problem to DONATE the images.
I saw here that many contributors are against this, but I'm sure others will perfectly agree.
The main reason I agree with DONATING, first because my pictures were reviewed for free by the DT team, second because I think all the contributors will benefit from that and third because a picture which doesn't have any sales actually worths (almost) nothing.
So those who are commenting about copyright must first have in mind that actually they cannot sell the right because most probably nobody would want to buy it. |
Because some images don't sell here, it doesn't mean they don't sell elsewhere.
The concept of free images to me is nonsense. It may generate a lot of traffic, but I wonder if it realle generates increase in sales. In another site, I can see how people found an image, and often it's a search for "free images". Not "royalty-free", but "free". How many people deliberately looking for free images will pay for images they want? Very few, I guess. Maybe the increase in traffic has side-beneficts, but I am really skeptical that the return is measurable.
I don't have any real numbers to justify my reasoning. I set a few images for free in anothe site once, temporarily, and I didn't notice any increase in my sales, despite of many downloads. Other people report similar results. Therefore my conclusion that the "free download" visitors are a completely separate clientelle, one that rarely would purchase an image.
I don't mind having old unselling images deleted, but I just don't agree with the free concept. |
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Mainly Canon A620 for microstock
Traditional photograph...
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Uploaded files:215 | Total Sales: 1472
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Message posted at 10/29/2009, 16:06:06 PM by Achilles - member is an admin |
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You don't have any numbers but you prefer to make speculations. Each thing we launched (assignments, subscriptions, news, editorial, initial free section, keymasters, flags, suggested keywords, sr-el just to name a few) brought discussions like this one. That the world will never be the same. Very healthy debates, up to the point where we get accused for something we didn't do. These attacks affect our image and they will not be tolerated.
This thread has reached the point where users will use speculations instead of arguments. And whenever someone disagrees, let's call him unethical, a thief or a dabbler.
If the discussion continues this way, the thread will be locked. We want to hear your thoughts as long as you act civilized. |
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Nikon D300 / Nikon N80 | Nikon 10.5mm f/2.8G ED AF DX Fishey...
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Uploaded files:2669 | Total Sales: 21465
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Message posted at 10/29/2009, 18:03:23 PM by Hipgnosis |
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Just a final word ... I'm on DT since 2005 and saw this site evolving and doing the things better and better. I don't have any reason to think that they are taking bad decisions or want to cheat us in any way. The site it is as it is now because they proved they know how to run their business. As far as I saw, everybody agreed that cleaning the database it is a great idea. Now, some of us considering that it is better to throw away some pictures instead of just moving them on the free section. Of course there is an option to try to sell the pictures elsewhere. That means to find another site like DT, making an account and whatever they will ask and put the pictures there. This will be a time consuming job and all of these for few pictures which had not one sale in 4 years. I was asked myself what else should I do better with these pictures ? For me it was obvious that moving the pictures to the free section it is the simplest and logical solution.
I learned from experience never underestimate the power of FREE on the internet.
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Sony NEX-5, Nikon D300s, Nikkor 24-120mm f/4G ED VR, Nikon ...
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Uploaded files:428 | Total Sales: 887
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