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Levels update (2012 levels)

Author Message
Dirkr
31 posts
73
Message posted at 04/27/2012, 04:29:18 AM by Dirkr
Thanks all for the explanations.
Looks like I did not fully understand the changes before.
So it's mainly an increase in prices with only some cases where royalties are cut.

Let's see how this works out, I'm more positive now.

Thanks again for clarifying and apologies for being so negative in the first place.


Uploaded files:938 | Total Sales: 764
Bogdan
360 posts
70
Message posted at 04/27/2012, 04:52:30 AM by Bogdan
I do not know what exacly to make about this change. Seems to me like a well taught royalty cut for non-exclusive contributors. Not a big difference, but none-the-less a royalty cut.

I understand that DT needs to compete with other agencies paying lower commisions. What I do not like is that they achieve this by cutting commisions from the photographers or increasing the prices for customers. This is the second royalty cut in the last years and (I think) the third price increase. I have to agree that all of these moves have been well taught without noticing a drop of income. I thrust therefore DT that they know what they are doing.

Looking to the competition, I think DT needs a face-lift. A new and modern interface, although the functionality of the current one deserves to be preserved. I hope the potential increase in DT's revenue through this last move will be used in this direction.

Myself, and I believe many other non-exclusive contributors, would like to stop working with other agencies which pay lower comissions. However, the income generated by DT for the contributors has to increase. I hope this moved will generate the 10-15% increase that Serban in mentioning, and thus attract more of us.

Bogdan
Body: Canon EOS 60D (18MP) Lenses: Canon EF 17-40...

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Androniques
813 posts
60
Message posted at 04/27/2012, 05:40:11 AM by Androniques
One thing I do not understand: I see my recently uploaded images still at level 0, whereas those sold jumped one level up, i.e. level 2 even with just one sale. I thought level 0 would be applied only to unsold images 1 (or 2?) years old back from today (27 April 2012).

Also, what about "unchanged subscriptions", are the subs prices/revenues going to stay as they were yesterday?
Nikon D5000, 18-105mm Nikkor VR, Nikon CP-8800 (rarely,...

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Baldas1950
548 posts
<10
Message posted at 04/27/2012, 05:40:23 AM by Baldas1950
Hope this new price structure will be helpful for us.
Nikon D90 Gimp 2.6 Adobe Photoshop

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Peanutroaster
1512 posts
67
Message posted at 04/27/2012, 06:44:05 AM by Peanutroaster
"If you worry about your royalties you should stop using agencies that provide low percentages or ask them to raise them for you. As long as you contribute there don't expect us to keep royalties more than theirs because it would be impossible to compete. "

Achilles makes a good basic point - as long as contributors are willing to give away images for peanuts, that's where the market will go. It would be nice to educate the general public on the value of their images so they stop giving away great images for nothing around the web, but its hard when contributors who claim to be serious about making money on their work, also give it away for next to nothing.
Http://www.edwardfielding.com Canon EOS 6D full frame ca...

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Peanutroaster
1512 posts
67
Message posted at 04/27/2012, 07:31:30 AM by Peanutroaster
Anyone else see a drop in their credits lately? My earned credits (from writing useful blogs) just dropped from 32 to 19 for some mysterious reason.
Http://www.edwardfielding.com Canon EOS 6D full frame ca...

Uploaded files:2555 | Total Sales: 2763
Peanutroaster
1512 posts
67
Message edited at 04/27/2012, 11:04:54 AM by Peanutroaster
Looks like the system had a hiccup. Says I downloaded an image that I did not. Someone just got a 13 credit bump on my dime.

--- FIXED and quickly! ----
Http://www.edwardfielding.com Canon EOS 6D full frame ca...

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Tangie
1645 posts
68
Message edited at 04/27/2012, 08:02:27 AM by Admin

Originally posted by Peanutroaster:
Quoted Message: Looks like the system had a hiccup. Says I downloaded an image that I did not. Someone just got a 13 credit bump on my dime.


Please contact support and provide all the details - image ID number, etc - for us to investigate. I am afraid we cannot help you on the message board with this.


Uploaded files:0 | Total Sales: 0
Neirfy
119 posts
74
Message edited at 04/27/2012, 09:41:35 AM by Neirfy

Originally posted by Achilles:
Quoted Message: The discrepancies you may have seen in the past days were due to the previous tests we did. Those customers continued to use the new system of pricing.This is not that complicated, almost everything that was already selling is now selling at a higher price (difference is bigger for small files and almost inexistent for higher ones) AND royalties are split the same.Let me try again, it seems my first post wasn`t clear enough.Old level 0 is now split into: - level 0 - gives you 5% less but these are files that didn`t sell in 2 years. And if they sell it`s only for the first download that you take a cut (price is the same). Note that after first download they jump straight at level 2.- level 1 - these were level 0 before and same royalties (25%) are awarded now, at higher priceOld level 1 is now level 2 - same royalties as before, higher priceOld level 2 is now level 3 - same royalties as before, higher priceOld level 3 is now level 4 - same royalties as before, higher priceOld level 4 is now level 5 - same royalties as before, higher priceOld level 5 remains level 5 but has lower royalties (5% less), for the same price.The only exceptions are the past level 5 and part of the past level 0. As you can see the vast majority of files still have the same royalties but sell at higher price. The revenue for almost all of them is split as before. Dreamstime still rewards 60% for its exclusive contributors, 8 years after its inception. They never took a hit, even though the margin for marketing is lower and it`s difficult to compete. But at least we know we have exclusive content and commited contributors. If you worry about your royalties you should stop using agencies that provide low percentages or ask them to raise them for you. As long as you contribute there don`t expect us to keep royalties more than theirs because it would be impossible to compete.

But all my images on-line now with 0 downloads (and recently uploaded too) are level 0. Is it a bag or it is intended so? So all that recent stuff will bring to me (and to other contributors) less that it could be with old shedule.


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Androniques
813 posts
60
Message posted at 04/27/2012, 08:11:25 AM by Androniques
Neirfy, I am sure it is a bug (read Achilles's posts here). Let them just investigate and correct it, and we will have the clarification soon :)
Nikon D5000, 18-105mm Nikkor VR, Nikon CP-8800 (rarely,...

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Intoit
37 posts
<10
Message posted at 04/27/2012, 08:51:32 AM by Intoit
woohoo!!
Canon Rebel, Canon Rebelxt, Canon 5D Canon 100mm Canon 50...

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Androniques
813 posts
60
Message edited at 04/27/2012, 09:48:06 AM by Androniques

Originally posted by Androniques:
Quoted Message: One thing I do not understand: I see my recently uploaded images still at level 0, whereas those sold jumped one level up, i.e. level 2 even with just one sale. I thought level 0 would be applied only to unsold images 1 (or 2?) years old back from today (27 April 2012). Also, what about "unchanged subscriptions", are the subs prices/revenues going to stay as they were yesterday?


By now I see it's been fixed, and I had actually some images sold for the first time at level 1, and some older ones jumping to level 2 after the (rushed ;)) first sale.
Great move, I should admit! :)
Nikon D5000, 18-105mm Nikkor VR, Nikon CP-8800 (rarely,...

Uploaded files:437 | Total Sales: 613
Xiaofeng123
467 posts
40
Message posted at 04/27/2012, 09:50:40 AM by Xiaofeng123
very nice for exclusive here.
I will report my revenue changes next month.
Nikon D3100,18-55 lens,35 1.8G lens.

Uploaded files:2466 | Total Sales: 925
Bradcalkins
2541 posts
84
Message posted at 04/27/2012, 10:11:41 AM by Bradcalkins
Couple of examples (with the caveat that buyers may pay different amounts for packages):

In Feb, Level 2 Small on an image earned me $2.83, while the same image size today sold at Level 3 and earned: $3.94.

In Feb, Level 3 XSmall on an image earned me $2.80, while the same image size today sold at Level 4 and earned: $3.50.

Whether this is a net gain will obviously depend on how many Level 5's you have, and hold many old versus new files, but personally i see this as more likely to improve revenue than not. While no one likes to see royalties drop, I see this as positive since it is likely to raise the revenue for me on the majority of images, and higher pricing for new images offers more encouragement to upload new content. I also appreciate that DT tests the waters PRIOR to the official announcement.

I've got close to 500 shots that are level 4 or 5 now - that has to help offset the level 5 reduction... Some focus on the royalty cut - but if you sell elsewhere you know there are few places (with any sales) that continue to offer 25-45% royalties. More like 15-25%. DT has a good system that returns high revenue per sale, especially for images that are proven sellers. Something DT also offers is the ability to get to the higher royalty rate with a small portfolio, since the rate is per image.

This also seems to increase revenue from subs in the sense that we will have more higher level images netting the double or triple pricing... Curious to see how this all shakes out!
Olympus OM-D EM-1: 12-40mm f/2.8, 75mm f1.8, 25mm f1.4, 50-2...

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Angelsimon
488 posts
69
Message posted at 04/27/2012, 11:22:00 AM by Angelsimon
I would like to see the end of all these experiments and come back to a normal working way. I hope all the changes has been done and we will have our level icons with respective colors near to our pictures, like some time ago...
In the other han, time will say us if this have been a good idea...
I use to work with first line Nikon equipment.

Uploaded files:2576 | Total Sales: 2357
Neirfy
119 posts
74
Message posted at 04/27/2012, 12:26:45 PM by Neirfy
yep - recent images with 0 downloads fixed to level 1
thankth!


Uploaded files:7135 | Total Sales: 2736
Alvera
2651 posts
77
Message posted at 04/27/2012, 12:43:43 PM by Alvera
I agree with Bradcalkins: "higher pricing for new images offers more encouragement to upload new content." This is good.
Nikon. 4x4 car for wildlife adventures. Inkscape for vectors...

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Drskn08
67 posts
58
Message posted at 04/27/2012, 12:52:28 PM by Drskn08
Thank you :-)


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Pancaketom
54 posts
Message edited at 04/27/2012, 13:18:54 PM by Pancaketom
On face value I like the idea of having the levels as they are now, with files that haven't sold in a year dropped down to level 0. That seems like a reasonable move. However the devil is usually in the details...

Ah, I see, another commission cut AGAIN. DT, this is getting tiresome. Now we are down to 20 to 45 %.

Remember when we used to get 50% of each sale.

That's right 50%. Half. The artist got 50% and the seller got 50%.

The first time commissions were cut it took a year before my income recovered despite being told how much it was going to improve my income.

Somehow DT has decided that 80% for them and 20% for the artist is acceptable in some situations. That sounds vaguely like a well known agency we know and hate.

Unfortunately with this confusing and somewhat opaque pricing scheme it is hard to tell how much was paid for the image compared to what we actually get. For instance, do we get less for sales where someone gets a referral bonus?

What will be the new low for a level 0 extra small sale? 14 cents, can we expect under 10 cents in the future?

I am very disappointed in the commission cuts DT, and I see no reason why you implemented them other than naked greed.



EDITED: - after looking at the details a bit more I see that commissions only drop for 2 cases: the new level 0 images (no sales over 2 years) from 25 to 20% - a 20% drop, but hopefully for only a small subset of sales.

And for the level 5 images from 50 to 45% - this is a 10% drop in our cut, so not really trivial (if it was trivial why did they have to do it, or why not bump it up 10%?) This will also become more significant as time goes on and more images reach this level.

I still don't believe that these commission cuts were necessary, but at least they aren't as across the board as they originally appeared. Time will tell if sales remain stable which would lead to a large increase in income for contributors and even more for DT or if sales will decrease and switch to subs which may hurt. I can't predict what the final result will be but I am still disappointed to see the commission cuts even if they aren't as drastic or across the board as I originally thought.
Canon Powershot A80, S3 IS, 400D, Pentax K-5 and any other c...

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Alvera
2651 posts
77
Message posted at 04/27/2012, 13:11:01 PM by Alvera
I get 60%. But I am exclusive :) And there are rumors that Dorian Kings like me will get 70% in the future :D
Nikon. 4x4 car for wildlife adventures. Inkscape for vectors...

Uploaded files:3918 | Total Sales: 4448
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