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Which way to go....exclusivity...AGAIN

Author Message
Miraclemoments
1207 posts
72
Message posted at 03/05/2013, 06:46:39 AM by Miraclemoments
Seeing that stock is very much a numbers game I was wondering if anybody here has been sorry about cancelling their exclusivity. I am battling to make a decision of whether I should stay exclusive or not.

Main thing driving my decision is that I could earn a little more. On the other hand it could prove to go worse....or not. That is why I need your input?
Canon 60D I AM A SIGMA AMBASSADOR Sigma 8-16 f4.5-5....

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Bogdanzagan
288 posts
78
Message posted at 03/05/2013, 12:02:01 PM by Bogdanzagan
I can give you an advice... for the moment do not renounce at exclusivity. Your portfolio is fit for DT. Unless you want to change something stay exclusive.

If you start removing backgrounds, shoot concepts, more stock oriented and you improve sales here, you may have a chance with other agencies.

I hope you don't take this personally and you can see the good side of this message.

Photography I use Nikon 105mm F2.8G, Nikon 35mm F1.8G, Nikon...

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Miraclemoments
1207 posts
72
Message posted at 03/05/2013, 12:55:13 PM by Miraclemoments
Thanks for the advice...have you tried other agencies yet?
Canon 60D I AM A SIGMA AMBASSADOR Sigma 8-16 f4.5-5....

Uploaded files:776 | Total Sales: 397
Mudplucker
469 posts
<10
Message posted at 03/05/2013, 13:18:59 PM by Mudplucker
Can i provide my 2 cents ?

My friend Yuri says if you need to live off the income then you need as many "potential" sales out there as possible. He even submits to a couple of places that even "Mudplucker" considers himself too good for, and my stuff to date is garbage, just look at it..... improving, yes, but not what i consider acceptable to work for Yuri Arcurs... although about to change :)

I have almost a 90 percent acceptance rate at another big agency.

However, i find that some places want you to upload a new model release for your regular models EVERY SINGLE PHOTO, EVERY DAY ! Sure you have to have them on file anyway, but to scan them to submit is just a pain if you have a lot of photos.

My take on what i plan to do: Some exclusive photos at all agencies but not an exclusive contributor. People Images to DT (My best ones will be exclusive here) only because they have an easier, TIME-SAVING model release policy. Any images rejected that DT does not want i will submit to elsewhere.

If i become world famous for my people shoots and DT would say "hey Mudplucker, we can't live without you. Will you be exclusive here ???? " then i would probably become exclusive because this is where i learned, where my friends are and the only forum i have ever posted on.....



Canon T2i and 5D classic, 85mm 1.8, 50mm 1.8, 70-200 F4 L I...

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Grisho
697 posts
78
Message posted at 03/05/2013, 13:20:44 PM by Grisho - member is an admin
I've done this in 2011. I cancelled my exclusivity and started to upload at other agencies. It just didn't work the way I was expecting it. I had around 10-20 % acceptance ratio of my already accepted images here at DT and very very few sales. Needless to say, sales and earnings decreased here as well. Several reasons why this happened - most of my files at that time were uploaded here back in 2009 and 2010 and were already considered "low quality" in the other agencies. They were selling pretty good at DT though as the levels pushed them forward in the search results. I also had solid positions in the search results here for my other images, so that dropped away too. My advice is that if you are planning to expand your portfolio steadily in the upcoming months, drop exclusivity and try out with other agencies. But if you are just transferring your portfolio without having time for continuous uploading - keep the exclusivity. If your images are good, your uploads to sales ratio is strong, you have good positions is the search results, you will benefit a lot from the 60 % commission as exclusive.

If you start doubting what is the right thing to do, you will always be wrong. If you're making more money with the other agencies, after some time you will start doubting if you could have made the same amount as exclusive at DT, without the hassle of managing with multiple agencies. So, just try it for yourself and learn from your experience.
Fuji X100S, Canon 550D

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Miraclemoments
1207 posts
72
Message posted at 03/05/2013, 13:24:00 PM by Miraclemoments
thanks mudplucker,

Well my intention is to start making enough so that my wife can stop working in the near future. The last few months have proven kind to me with sales and I was thinking that with my images on other agencies, even if I got half the sales at each that I got at DT I would benefit more.

Canon 60D I AM A SIGMA AMBASSADOR Sigma 8-16 f4.5-5....

Uploaded files:776 | Total Sales: 397
Miraclemoments
1207 posts
72
Message posted at 03/05/2013, 13:28:37 PM by Miraclemoments

Originally posted by Grisho:
Quoted Message: I`ve done this in 2011. I cancelled my exclusivity and started to upload at other agencies. It just didn`t work the way I was expecting it. I had around 10-20 % acceptance ratio of my already accepted images here at DT and very very few sales. Needless to say, sales and earnings decreased here as well. Several reasons why this happened - most of my files at that time were uploaded here back in 2009 and 2010 and were already considered "low quality" in the other agencies. They were selling pretty good at DT though as the levels pushed them forward in the search results. I also had solid positions in the search results here for my other images, so that dropped away too. My advice is that if you are planning to expand your portfolio steadily in the upcoming months, drop exclusivity and try out with other agencies. But if you are just transferring your portfolio without having time for continuous uploading - keep the exclusivity. If your images are good, your uploads to sales ratio is strong, you have good positions is the search results, you will benefit a lot from the 60 % commission as exclusive.If you start doubting what is the right thing to do, you will always be wrong. If you`re making more money with the other agencies, after some time you will start doubting if you could have made the same amount as exclusive at DT, without the hassle of managing with multiple agencies. So, just try it for yourself and learn from your experience.


The plan is to increase my portfolio in the months to come....will be trying to reach at least the 600 mark by year end if not more. So for a start I would of course be transferring images to other sites as well but would then continue uploading as much and quickly as I can
Canon 60D I AM A SIGMA AMBASSADOR Sigma 8-16 f4.5-5....

Uploaded files:776 | Total Sales: 397
Mudplucker
469 posts
<10
Message posted at 03/05/2013, 13:36:21 PM by Mudplucker
Miraclemoments: with your eye for composition you will do well no matter what you decide. And you are one of the many friends i was referring to that i love to talk to and get advice from here on the boards, so hopefully you will keep the DT board your main forum even if you venture off to other sites. I talk alot about "Yuri this and Yuri that" i know but i have learned just as much or more from all of you here on the boards... I'd name you all but there are just too many names to even mention.
Canon T2i and 5D classic, 85mm 1.8, 50mm 1.8, 70-200 F4 L I...

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Miraclemoments
1207 posts
72
Message posted at 03/05/2013, 13:42:46 PM by Miraclemoments
Thanks mudplucker.....appreciate the kind words. I will for sure be here on the boards at DT. DT remains my first choice. I just need to get my stuff out there so my wife can stop working and look after our kids. Not planning on making thousands and thousands each month...just enough to cover her expenses per month which are not high.
Canon 60D I AM A SIGMA AMBASSADOR Sigma 8-16 f4.5-5....

Uploaded files:776 | Total Sales: 397
Tonygers
330 posts
74
Message posted at 03/06/2013, 12:49:17 PM by Tonygers
Unless you have at least a few thousand images ready for upload to other agencies I wouldn't consider it at the moment. But for the future and if you're serious about this business as a career then yes go with as many sites as you can.
Nikon D90 12.3 megapixel Nikon D60 10 megapixel Nikkor 50m...

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Afagundes
3244 posts
<10
Message posted at 03/06/2013, 15:11:21 PM by Afagundes
Miraclemoments, I don´t think its such a good idea.

DT pays a higher comission and its good for the images who escalate, so, for good portfolios.

If you share your portfolio with other agencies, you will loose a lot of comissions and I think wont add much sales in other agencies.

If you are not pleased with DT, than move to another, and be exclusive there!

Sharing among agencies will probably only decrease your earnings, we´ve heard it from several people now.

If you had more time, than you wouldn´t have 378 images here, but thousands, doesn´t seem to be the case, your time is limited (like everybody elses), so instead of wasting time uploading to several agencies (believe me its going to take a load of work to do that), take your time to take more and better images, better keywords, and upload here.

If you want to diversify, than try some other ways to earn money besides microstock, try RM, developp your own site, sell books, training, commission work, etc. Otherwise is just sharing profits among the same, I don´t see the point.

As usual, Mudplucker is talking about Yuri, there is nothing wrong to understand what the big fish are doing, but you have to understand he is not a person, but an enterprise, if you dont have those extra hands helping you, you have to think on the limited amount of time you have and take the most of it.

So, back to basics, a good portfolio will escalate and generate extra earnings. If you sell the same images somewhere else, buyers might find them there and buy them cheaper, so it doesnt make sense to escalate them here.

My strategy has been to use social media and try to advertise myself, so that buyers come here an buy my images. So, I am investing my time on increasing my portfolio and on advertising it.

But that´s just my opinion.

If you do try something else like dropping exclusivity, please let us know what was the result of your experience.
Canon EOS 5D Mark II Canon EF 17-40mm USM f/4L Canon EF 24...

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Bigpressphoto
345 posts
Message posted at 03/06/2013, 18:17:47 PM by Bigpressphoto
ai have considered eclusivity or not I have have 250 images online with a 3.5 downloads per image. recently increased my images online to 360 Im limited with time, but if I get them up they sell.
Should I go exclusive contributor on DT?.... I already have most here listed as exclusive images.
take a look and tell me what you think those on DT for sometime thanks

Nikon D90 and Nikon coolpix cameras and lenses WC-E 67 Pent...

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Afagundes
3244 posts
<10
Message posted at 03/06/2013, 18:26:38 PM by Afagundes
Bigpressphoto your situation is a bit different, you have a fantastic selling portfolio, several level 5 images and many more to come,

Why would you jeopardize this going somewhere else?

Your buyers will go there just to buy your images cheaper!
Canon EOS 5D Mark II Canon EF 17-40mm USM f/4L Canon EF 24...

Uploaded files:9645 | Total Sales: 15282
Igordabari
3638 posts
62
Message posted at 03/06/2013, 18:50:54 PM by Igordabari

Originally posted by Bigpressphoto:
Quoted Message: Im limited with time, but if I get them up they sell.Should I go exclusive contributor on DT?....


WIth limited time it will be difficult to support avtivity with several agencies.

It never makes a sense to be 'a little bit pregnant': either one stays on DT only or one works with at least 3 (better 4) agencies. Otherwise revenue lost at DT will not be compensated by income from other sites, as income from DT will fall down with a factor at least 50%.

Consider that keywording (title/description) rules are different for all stocks. So, one needs to do keywording several times for each image. That's a mess and that's takes time, so if time is limited leaving exclusivity seems to be a bad idea.
I, me, myself + cameras: Canon 450d (for astrophoto...

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Afagundes
3244 posts
<10
Message posted at 03/06/2013, 19:57:30 PM by Afagundes

Originally posted by Igordabari:
Quoted Message: either one stays on DT only or one works with at least 3 (better 4) agencies..., so if time is limited leaving exclusivity seems to be a bad idea.


Excelent advise Igordabari, straight to the point.
Canon EOS 5D Mark II Canon EF 17-40mm USM f/4L Canon EF 24...

Uploaded files:9645 | Total Sales: 15282
Miraclemoments
1207 posts
72
Message posted at 03/06/2013, 23:43:27 PM by Miraclemoments
Thanks guys and you got me thinking again in a different way. I should rather start looking at getting my PF here up to scratch and generate a good amount every month instead of trying to dilute and then build up again.

thanks for all the input everyone....!!!!
Canon 60D I AM A SIGMA AMBASSADOR Sigma 8-16 f4.5-5....

Uploaded files:776 | Total Sales: 397
68
Message posted at 03/07/2013, 01:34:26 AM by Robinstockphotos
There you go again. haha!
Seriously, don't leave exclusivity. Honestly and impartially, people like us don't count among those with an optimized portfolio and we don't know for sure what would happen if we do leave exclusivity. It might be like....30% of your port gets rejected on the other top sites. All your images get accepted on sites with barely any sales and your DT search results stop coming up with your photos first. That would be a total loss.

I have seen some contributors with highly specific images. Look at the featured contributors. They follow something unique. Like that guy who made a whole port with ant photos. Such portfolios would do great if distributed all over because they would be unique wherever they go. Our portfolios would add to the general photos on the other sites. But that is the part of the results.

Think of the upload process. Uploading 300+ images to 4 or 5 other sides is totally crazy. You'd go into depression once or twice anyway. I get depressed keywording on this site alone. :P

The mention of Yuri Arcurs in this matter is totally irrelevant. Look at him and look at us. If he stops uploading to any site and starts selling CDs with images, he'd still probably retain 90% of the customers. He has a stable customer base. I'm sure some people go straight to him for what they want and not search the general database.

Stay with DT. The site is probably going to excel and might even exceed others. People don't have complains like they have on other sites. Imagine having a portfolio of 10,000 honestly GOOD images here. You know the style here. You know what gets accepted and what has sold. So push yourself and put in a really dedicated and serious effort. Your monthly uploads are about 10. Step it up. Personally, I'm aiming for a 5000 strong exclusive port here. Tough but possible. You'd do great, just hang on. :)
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Lfmpereira
347 posts
<10
Message posted at 03/07/2013, 04:09:22 AM by Lfmpereira
It is your call, but i've quited exclusivity, and i am not sorry about it. I find that other agencies have shorter pendind times, have different criteria of rejection, and although i dont sell much (because i also dont have amazing images on my portfolio), i truly believe i will never be sorry of my decision. The sales here are very low for me, and i get some rejections that almost makes me become a religions man, because i keep saying "oh my God, how could they reject this image?".

Like i said, it's your call, but i would not hesitate. I would go for it.
Nikon D3100 Nikon 18-105 Sigma 50mm f2.8

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Bigpressphoto
345 posts
Message posted at 03/07/2013, 04:34:40 AM by Bigpressphoto
thankyou Afgundes for the compliments, but I think most if you did not answer my question, I was not discussing leaving DT. I said... I sell most of my photos under exclusive here on DT. but I am not an exclusive photographer on DT, I have already experienced other sites, so I know them.
My question was, yes I have a good selling portfolio here on DT, but its gowing slowly as I add 10 or so a month. My question was should I reguster as exclusive photog, which means I cannot have my photos on other sites and use only dreamstime, which means if DT goes bankrupt I go bankrupt with them. I only want the opinion of those who are actually exclusive here on DT or were in the past.
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Fred11
170 posts
Message edited at 03/07/2013, 05:34:34 AM by Fred11
In the traditional world of stock-agencies, exclusivity works very, very well. In fact exclusivity is a must at our better RM agencies.
There are a few agencies around that have given the word exclusivity a "bad" name, unfortunately that is.

However if I were to go exclusive with a micro-agency? I could only think of two and DT, would definetely be one of them.

Just for the record, I have been exclusive with the biggest-RM-House collection there is since 1993 and its worked out to perfection, no complaints at all.
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